PAT: But having that authority that God has made healing simple! We’re going to be right back with “Something More!” [Music] with Pastor Sandra Kennedy! And get ready! You need to prepare yourself because God is going to heal your body in your home! I believe that with everything inside of me! Get ready!  

[Music]

[Music]

PAT: I want to welcome you back to “Something More!” We are with Pastor Sandra Kennedy! God has used her in a powerful way to go into hospitals, nursing homes! Her and her team laying hands on the sick! I’m going to tell you that they may not be able to feel it at home, I hope they do, but the presence of God is here!

SANDRA: Yes, He’s here. Yes!

PAT: People’s infirmities, sickness. Psalms 103. He forgives all your sin. Heals all your diseases! People don’t understand that God is a God of healing power!

SANDRA: Amen!

PAT: And you know without faith you can’t even please God!

SANDRA: Amen!

PAT: And you know one of the things you write about in your book, you know, “The Simplicity of Healing” and healing made simple and how God is using you. Talk to us about this! One of the things you say that really, really struck at my spirit. And number one I want you to tell us what happened with your mom.  

SANDRA: Uh-huh.

PAT: But then after that tell us about bottom line allowing the scriptures to be your medicine. Talk to us!

SANDRA: Okay. Well you know I left you with throwing all of mom’s medicine in the trash can. Well anyway, the long and short of it is that kind of stirred her. Began to wake her up a little bit. And then I had these thoughts. Both of us from the South down Georgia way you’ll get this one.

PAT: Yeah.

SANDRA: The thought popped into my mind anoint her with oil! Now I had never seen anybody anointed with oil ever in my life! Ever!

PAT: Well in all through this God’s word.

SANDRA: Well I had never seen anybody and you know when you haven’t seen anybody if you noticed it doesn’t tell you where to put it! [Laughs]

PAT: [Laughs]

SANDRA: I’m green now. I’m green. I’m just trying to do what God said.

PAT: [Laughing]

SANDRA: And so we couldn’t find any oil but we found a can of Crisco lard!

PAT: I just preached about when I was a kid we couldn’t afford that anointing oil stuff! We just grabbed a can of lard!

SANDRA: Absolutely! And I didn’t have time to melt it down now, honey!

PAT: [Laughing]

SANDRA: I didn’t have time for all that stuff!

PAT: You got to be careful you’ll cut your finger!

SANDRA: I’m telling you! 

PAT: Anyway.

SANDRA: We greased her up like a hog! From the top of her head to the soles of her feet we greased her!

PAT: Haah!

SANDRA: Because we could figure out where the place was we were supposed to put it! And you know we didn’t want to miss anything and we were serious! We were serious!

PAT: [Laughs] I love this! I’m laughing because I love it!

SANDRA: And we couldn’t even hold her in the chair she was so greased! But I want you to know when we put that last dab on her, [Laughing] glory to God, she just got healed!

PAT: [Laughing]

SANDRA: Why don’t you go a little bit further? “Actually.”

AUDIENCE: Actually.

SANDRA: I came here healed!

AUDIENCE: I came here healed! [Shouting and clapping]

SANDRA: But I’m just beginning to realize it!

AUDIENCE: But I’m just beginning to realize it!

SANDRA: And once my mind.

AUDIENCE: And once my mind.

SANDRA: Agrees with the Word of God.

AUDIENCE: Agrees with the Word of God.

SANDRA: Watch out!

AUDIENCE: Watch out!

SANDRA: There’s nothing on this earth or in hell.

AUDIENCE: There’s nothing on this earth or in hell.

SANDRA: That can hold back what my God says I have!

AUDIENCE: That can hold back what my God says I have!

SANDRA: See you got to – I’m watching. Some of you are even scared to say all that! You know? Because you’re scared somebody’s going to ask you what happened!

AUDIENCE: [Laughter]

SANDRA: And you’re just scared that you’re going to still feel bad so you don’t want to – you know I don’t want to tell them a lie. I mean dear God, I see I still got it. You say you still got it when God took it? How come we’re keeping something He took? See it’s your brain! You got to get your brain. You got to get your brain. Let’s talk about the woman with the issue of blood. I like her story! Man, I’ve told it so many times! But let’s just come at it a little different touch this time. You know the woman. You know the woman. She’d been watching you know Fox News.

AUDIENCE: [Laughter]

SANDRA: And she’d been watching Fox News and she found out that Jesus was downtown near the mall. And so she had, the Bible says, that she had this problem with the blood. You know an issue of blood for 12 years and had suffered many things of many physicians. Spent all that she had. Nothing was better and everything grew worse. How many people have done things like that? Yes? Now let me tell you this. We thank God for good doctors. We thank God for good nurses. We thank God for His medicine. 

AUDIENCE: Yes! Amen!

SANDRA: Well some of you think you – are you thankful for it?

AUDIENCE: Yes!

SANDRA: Most of us would be dead if we hadn’t had it! Hallelujah! Come on!

AUDIENCE: Amen!

SANDRA: Well that – Lord, get ‘em get a letter about that one. But anyway.

AUDIENCE: [Laughter] 

SANDRA: Here we go! Okay! When she had heard of Jesus she came in the press behind. Touched His garment. Remember everything got worse. She touched His garment for she said, “If I may touch his clothes I shall be whole!” And straightway the fountain of her blood was dried up. She felt in her body that she was healed of that plague. And Jesus immediately knowing in Himself that virtue had gone out of Him turned Him about.” I’m just reading it so you remember it. “In the press and said, ‘Who touched my clothes?’ And his disciples said unto Him, ‘Thou see-est the multitude of the throng and then sayeth who touched me?’ And He looked round about to see her that had done this thing. But the woman, fearing and trembling, knowing what was done in her, came and fell down before Him and told Him all the truth. And He said unto her, ‘Daughter, thy faith has made thee whole! Go in peace. Be whole of thy plague.’” Now I want to show you a few little things that she did. Simple little things. Every bit of it had to do with a decision. Everything she did was based on a decision she made! First of all, she heard. She heard! She heard that Jesus – something about Jesus. Obviously, she heard He was a healer. Have you ever heard Jesus is a healer?

AUDIENCE: Yes.

SANDRA: There is no healer but Jesus!

AUDIENCE: Right!

BRENDA: All forces of darkness and evil must cease and desist from any maneuver, any operation being attempted against this household. Our house is protected by the blood of Jesus and a divine hedge surrounds our property and the angels of the Most High stand guard. We live in safety and peace. Our house is a no fly zone to the devil. Hallelujah.

SID: I tell you what, when you decree what God says, God causes it to be on earth as it is in heaven. I want you to decree that you are a child of God, that Jesus lives inside of you, your sins are totally forgiven and that you are making Him Lord of your life and you have intimacy with Him. Repeat out loud right now, out loud with me, dear God…

Audience: Dear God…

SID: I’m a sinner.

Audience: … I’m a sinner.

SID: And I’m so sorry.

Audience: And I’m so sorry.

SID: I believe…

Audience: I believe…

SID: … the blood of Jesus…

Audience: … the blood of Jesus…

SID: … washes away my sins.

Audience: … washes away my sins.

SID: And I’m clean.

Audience: And I’m clean.

SID: And now that I’m clean…

Audience: And now that I’m clean…

SID: … I ask you Jesus…

Audience: … I ask you Jesus…

SID: … to live inside of me.

Audience: … to live inside of me.

SID: Thank you that you’re my Savior.

Audience: Thank you that you’re my Savior.

SID: Thank you that you’re my Lord.

Audience: Thank you that you’re my Lord.

SID: Thank you that I have great intimacy with you.

Audience: Thank you that I have great intimacy with you.

SID: Thank you that I’m your sheep.

Audience: Thank you that I’m your sheep.

SID: I hear your voice.

Audience: I hear your voice.

SID: Amen.

Audience: Amen.

SID: Brenda, pray whatever God is giving you right now.

BRENDA: Yes. And right now, I just feel led to speak this over your life, that you come to a place where you’re not dealing anymore with fear. And I want to stretch my hands towards you as you’re watching that fear is dispelled over your life, that anything that has been trying to make you afraid. And maybe it is family related. Maybe it’s something out in the culture, things that are happening. There is not a lot of good news out there, if you look on the media or if you look on the TV screens, but if you just look at God’s Word, there is good news. And I just want to break that fear over you right now. I look at you and I say, don’t be afraid.

In fact, right now, I want to decree that the angels that are there, that are in your house, come on, they’re in your house, they’re assigned to you, so I just decree that the angels of the Lord are surrounding you right now. Come on, you can sense them. I know you can. That they’re around your home. They’re around your family. And they’re standing watch to ensure that you don’t experience any tragedy or harm.

In fact, mama, quit worrying about how your children are going to turn out, quit worrying and being up at night fretting. God’s up. He’s got them taken care of. He’s in whatever city they’re in. He’s at the school with them. He’s there.

And I prophesy that you are under the charge, your family, the guard of the heavenly host. They are keeping your family secure. No member of your family can be harmed or injured. I put that out in the Spirit right now. And I say, there is a hedge of protection because of the angels, the host. I say, host go and protect every family. And I say that the house, your perimeter, all your property, your possessions, everything you own cannot even be attacked by a thief, an attacker, a burglar, a plunderer. They can’t access your dwelling because the angels are standing there with swords drawn. And my word to you today is, do not fear. All shall be well for you and for your family, in Jesus’ name. Hallelujah.

JAMIE: That’s fascinating! Now when you’re talking about the imagination.

SHAWN: Yes.

SHAWN: Is it for you almost like a wind that you catch in a sail or is it something that you sit in silence for? Or how does it begin when you start receiving a download in your imagination?

JAMIE: Well, first of all, you must clear all thoughts. You must take captive of all thoughts and one thing to do is you must – again it goes back to being silent – silencing your soul so your spirit man can begin to really open up and really be able to articulate the things that it’s trying to say. Cause see we have a lot of traffic up here.

JAMIE: Yeah.

SHAWN: So sometimes we have to make sure that the traffic has died down before we can actually clear the highway.

JAMIE: Totally.

SHAWN: So the Lord can just come in and really talk to us and bring us to the next level of the other side of the bridge where He’s trying to get us.

JAMIE: So you’re in the middle of receiving this download. You’ve silenced your brain.

SHAWN: Yes. [laughing]

JAMIE: You know your mind is under your control.

SHAWN: Correct.

JAMIE: Right.

SHAWN: Correct. Correct.

JAMIE: And so then in that moment you’re yielded to the Holy Spirit.

SHAWN: You’re yielded to the Holy Spirit.

JAMIE: And He starts to speak to you.

SHAWN: Yes. Well, the thing is, again the Bible tells us to take every thought captive anything that tries to exalt itself above the knowledge of God. First of all, we have to know what is the knowledge of God. Once we understand what is His knowledge, what is He saying we can know what other thoughts are not His knowledge.   

JAMIE: Wow! That is KEY!

SHAWN: And that’s the key to us understanding so reading our word will help us know that hey this thought is not of God. This thought is of the flesh. So I can begin to really understand what’s His voice versus what’s my voice. You know again like I said before it’s a still small voice, not a loud racing voice!

JAMIE: Wow!

SHAWN: So that’s how we got to be able to determine that it’s Him versus us! 

JAMIE: See that is – someone asked me that same question last night.

SHAWN: Yes.

JAMIE: They said how do you know whether it’s God speaking to you or just your own thoughts? 

SHAWN: Right. Right.

JAMIE: And I said well – or even the devils! 

SHAWN: Yeah. Yeah.

JAMIE:  You know even the devils. Right?

SHAWN: Yes. Yes. Yes.

JAMIE: I mean when you hear a thought and you know it’s the devil but it’s like disguised.

SHAWN: Right.

JAMIE: How do you discern that?

SHAWN: Well, first of all, this is how I learned. Several times in the scripture God will call someone and He’ll say their name two or three times. Moses, Moses. Abraham, Abraham. The Bible says out of the mouth of two or three witnesses My word is established.

JAMIE: Whoooh!

ART: And there’s a difference between Your communion with the Father and mine right now. If I’d have been walking in the same kind of faith I’d have seen Your results! So teach me to be like You! And over and over and over He shows me these little things that’s He’s like here’s what you could have done better. I like to compare it to it’s almost like a dad teaching His son to ride a bike. When I started in healing ministry I’m praying for people to get healed and it was like 95% everybody’s getting healed. You know? And then all of a sudden around November it just stopped! All the results stopped! I’m like what do I do? Like did – was I wrong? I thought this was for every believer. Maybe it was a gift and it lifted. Like did I sin? What happened? So I went to the Lord. I’m like God why isn’t it working? Why is nobody getting healed? It’s been like a week and everybody I’ve ministered to – nothing! And He said well up until now you’ve been asking Me to do what I told you to do. Which in Matthew10:8 He commanded heal the sick. He didn’t say ask My Father to heal the sick! 

JAMIE: Umm. Uh-huh!

ART: So I said oh! All right. So I stopped saying God please heal this person and I started saying be healed in Jesus’ name! And all the result came back! And then it was like – so it was almost like dad’s running alongside the bike and I’m going like I’m riding a two-wheeler. This is great and then he’s like all right, watch what you’re doing and he let’s go and boom! Right? And then he picks me up and he says all right. This time son hold that handlebar steady. Right? And the next time you know handlebar’s steady but next time – no one showed me how to stop this thing and I smack into a house. It’s like over the last 6 years I’ve had moment – more than 6 years now but I’ve had moment after moment of like the results shut down. I go to the Lord what do You want to teach me this time? And as soon as He teaches me I apply that and the results pick up again! So I never have this idea that I’ve arrived like just because healings are happening it’s not cause I’ve figured everything out. It’s because Dad’s running alongside the bike. And then He wants to grow me and mature me into sonship cause what can God do with a fully realized son? Jesus was just the tip of the iceberg! He said greater works than these will you do because I’m going to the Father!   

JAMIE: Wow! This in incredible! Art, I appreciate your honesty! Look, we’re going to be right back. I’m going to ask Art how he stays motivated in his ministry [music begins] so that he can continue to press on for greater levels of glory, greater accuracy in healing! Stay tuned because you’re going to want to hear this!

JOHN: Do you feel it now?

WOMAN #5: Yes.

JOHN: And it’s right there and it’s from surgery?

WOMAN #5: Yes.

JOHN: Explain what sort of surgery did you have? 

WOMAN #5: It was colon surgery. 

JOHN: Can we pray? What’s your name?

WOMAN #5: Shirlene.

JOHN: Can we pray for Shirlene? Let’s pray right now? And you know what? You know what? I’m want to encourage. As I pray you reach out. You know just walking into this building there is an atmosphere for miracles! Even before I start praying there is an atmosphere for the supernatural! I want to encourage you as I pray say, “Jesus! I’ll have some of that, please!” Let’s pray! 

WOMAN #5: I have a ringing in my ears, too.

JOHN: A ringing in your ears?   

WOMAN #5: Uh-huh.

JOHN: Jesus, right now touch this lady! RIGHT NOW! Choooh! No more pain! OUT! OUT! Eche fuera! Fuera! Fuera! Let it go out! Out! Off the ears! Let her go now! Now! Phew! And God, her ears! Out! Eche fuera! Fuera! Fuera! Let her go! Out! Out! Out! Chooh! Chooh! Now! Let her go! Out! Watch out for Shirlene! Oh, there’s somebody here. Man, your knee. Your knee. You know when you walk, man, your knee! The pain even getting out of a chair. Man, you feel it! Your knee. Just come here. This lady here. Man! A knee lady. So how much time have I got? How’s it going for time? Okay. Okay. I’ll say it right now. Okay. Right now I want to talk to the believers at home. The viewers. I want to encourage you right now as I pray, you can believe for yourself! You know the anointing can flow into your living room, wherever you are. In your app! The anointing is here to heal! There is no distance in prayer! So as I pray you can say, “I’ll have some of that!” And the power of God can flow in your life too! And ma’am, what’s up with you?

WOMAN #6: Ahh! I injured my knee playing basketball in college. And when I was older in my forties I fell when I was living in Korea on black ice and I think I broke my tailbone. But an angel picked me up and took the pain out so I never went to the doctor. But I compensated and someone told me it’s something in my back and it’s causing pain in my knee. So my leg is shorter and I can’t run or function.

JOHN: And so to get up here and walk was it painful?

WOMAN #6: Sometimes yeah.

JOHN: Do you have it right now when you walk?

WOMAN #6: Yeah. 

JOHN: And there’s this right leg. An injury to your tailbone. What’s your name?

WOMAN #6: Michelle.

JOHN: Can we pray for Michelle? You know it’s very interesting. You know God heals in different ways. But one way is putting on hands. A bit later I’m pray over you going to and God’s going to heal you in your seat without even laying on hands. But right now I’m just doing a demonstration of laying on of hands. I’m going to pray. You can feel the power now coming!

WOMAN #6: I can feel the power of God!

SID: You call it “The Song of the Lord.” Where’d you get that from?

JOSHUA: It came straight from heaven. The Holy Spirit taught me how to enter into, engage in this realm of praise and worship. You know there was, I was over in London England a couple of weekends ago and things were going on, there was you know always, there’s always swirlings and things that were just trying to distract my attention and it’s amazing how easily the enemy wants to get us to be offended. Have you ever noticed that? That

SID: It takes no talent, it take no talent to be offended! (laughs)

JOSHUA: Right. Right. And so I woke up this one morning and some things had come at me and some words had been spoken and there was, I could tell that a spirit of offence was trying to take over my heart and instantly I knew you know what? God gives me a new song to overcome every attempt of the enemy to distract me from His purposes. He surrounds me with songs of deliverance and so I just began to lift up my hands in worship I just began to sing: “Great peace have they who love Thy word and nothing will offend them. Great peace have they who love Thy word and nothing will offend them.” And you know I just begin to sing that over and over and over again.

SID: You know where’s the drum and piano. This sounds so good we should be recording it right now, Joshua.

JOSHUA: (LAUGHS)

SID: But I do want to, I do want to say that we have this wonderful “Simple Supernatural Package” which includes the Book and Workbook and then the book “Atmosphere.” I imagine people say to you Joshua it has made such a difference in their life, recognizing that YOU have something to do with the atmosphere that you’re walking in. You can change your family! You can change your school! You can change your business! You can change wherever you can walk to or drive to!

JOSHUA: Absolutely! Everything changes in the right atmosphere. And that’s what God is teaching us. He’s giving us Keys to create the proper atmosphere, the atmosphere that will be conducive to releasing the divine manifest glory presence of God.

SID: So we have the two Books, the Workbook, the soaking CD and the book “Atmosphere” available for an investment of 49 dollars or more. Joshua, just, just a minute or so, last thought.

JOSHUA: Well you know what? I believe that the right atmosphere determines your growth. And in the right atmosphere you will grow in the Lord. You will grow in success. You will grow in miracles. And I believe it’s God’s heart that we all grow in the supernatural. And so I really encourage those that are listening to grab hold of these resources and passionately pursue what God has called you to be. You are supernatural! He created you to live a supernatural life!

SID: Well let me know what you think of our new digital show. It’s called Something More. And it’s my desire that this show would be such a free flow of God’s Spirit that no matter what’s going on in your life the peace of God will arrest you and any deep thing it’ll make your house a demon-free zone! How’s that sound? I pray that in Jesus’ name! And come back sometime for more of Something More!

SID: Now I understand that you play music in your home through speakers in every room

JOSHUA: I do.

SID: and most of the music is your own. What happens to the atmosphere when you play that kind of music throughout 24/7?

JOSHUA: We play the music in our home because it’s healing music. It’s delivering music. You know the Bible says that “He’ll surround you with songs of deliverance.” And in our home there’s such a peace and such a glory, a presence of God that it just an atmosphere that’s pregnant for miracles and signs and wonders to break forth.

SID: You know you are provoking our audience to such jealousy right now!

JOSHUA: (laughing)

SID: But we’re also making and I’m really impressed with this, you have a book and a workbook. It’s, and I love the title, “Simple Supernatural.”

JOSHUA: Right.

SID: Because do you believe the supernatural should be simple or should be great mysteries for only profound people to enter in to?

JOSHUA: I believe that the Gospel should be simple and I believe that part of the Gospel is the fact that it is supernatural. The supernatural should be simple for people. And we’ve just laid it out in that book and in the workbook for people to enter into these realms and to begin to discover this for themselves.

SID: You actually go to the basics and then you develop already all the way to this book of yours called “Atmosphere.” As far as I’m concerned this REALLY gives you access to the supernatural. What kind of feedback are you getting on your book “Atmosphere” and why is atmosphere so important?

JOSHUA: You know what? I believe atmosphere is essential. Atmosphere is everything. In the right atmosphere you will receive the right rewards. I mean that’s just the way it is. And in an atmosphere of glory it’s heaven on earth. The blessings of God are able to manifest and so I believe atmosphere is so important. We actually had a lady over, a pastor in South Korea come up to me last year with tears in her eyes so thankful I had written this book “Atmosphere” because there were blockages in her church and ministry and she didn’t know how to break out of the norm. She didn’t know how to get higher into the glory. She didn’t know how to break into new places in the presence of God. And she said when she read the book “Atmosphere” I literally laid it out precept upon precept and just every “Key” she had written, uh, or every Key she had read she said that it spoke to something in her life that she was dealing with and she was literally able to break through the very next Sunday and they were able to have the most glorious service she had ever had. And she was so thankful that I had put these concepts and these ideas and these revelations God had given me onto the written page.

SID: You said “God had given you.” Do you really believe God gave this to you?

JOSHUA:I believe that God is speaking to me every single day. I believe that He’s continually downloading revelation. And the reasons is that I produced the Book, the CD’s, all of it, they come out of that revelation that God has given to me. Absolutely.

SID: Okay, I want to have the Book and the Workbook, “Simple Supernatural,” the book “Atmosphere” plus the additional “bonus CD” for your soaking for an investment of 49 dollars or more. And do you want something more on atmosphere? I do! We’ll be right back.

LAURA: [laughs] And that’s what’s behind so many times we try to fix someone else. You know I was telling my children the other day okay, so we’ve known a lot of people who get married and then 6 years, 7 years later they got divorced. It’s like the seven year itch or something. I said opposites attract! God gave you to each other for a reason.    

DAWNA: Yeah. Yeah.

LAURA: And then all those things that you absolutely loved suddenly you want to change them. But that’s not our responsibility. So I love that and I pray that that really ministered to somebody! All right. Now let me ask you this one other thing. When you see someone who comes in and they are bound up like that. You said that it happens quickly, even quicker – somebody who’s been in therapy a very long time. Have you ever dealt with people who are on the brink of committing suicide they were so desperate?

DAWNA: Oh absolutely!

LAURA: Yeah. I imagine.

DAWNA: Absolutely! Many times. We have people come in that are so desperate that they’re just like you know this is my last chance. Or speaking of husbands and wives, it was my wife sent me. We’re going to get a divorce if this doesn’t work. I’m like oh, no pressure at all! But any of those situations you know God is faithful and He’s able to answer! I think really the issue is connection to the Holy Spirit. So we are paying attention to the Holy Spirit. They are paying attention to the Holy Spirit and He knows what’s going on inside.    

LAURA: Yeah, He does.

DAWNA: It’s not a surprise to God what you think. It’s not a surprise to God what you feel. And I have a friend that said you know feelings aren’t truth but they are true.

LAURA: Right.

DAWNA: You know it’s like but they’re not telling you the truth so it’s interesting to see what are the feelings down inside? And so if you want to commit suicide there’s a reason for that.

LAURA: Yeah.

DAWNA: And it could be the atmosphere telling you. It could be an assignment over the area. Or it could be that you’re just discouraged so much. Things aren’t working out the way you planned. Yeah. 

LAURA: All right! Great! I want us to wait right there and then after the break [music begins] we’re going to touch on that more again. So stay with us! There’s something more on Something More! I’m Laura Harris Smith and we’re here today with author Dawna De Silva.

LAURA: Hi everyone! Welcome back to Something More! Before the break we were talking with our friend Dawna De Silva. And she was describing just some different ministry situations that she has encountered in Bethel Sozo, her ministry. De Silva Ministries. And you know we touched on the fact that there was somebody we felt like that maybe they were thinking about committing suicide. Sometimes it’s not that drastic. Maybe for you it’s just hopelessness. I just kept seeing darkness all around someone. You’re watching television and you don’t even quite know why you tuned in today. We’re not asking you for anything. We are just saying that God can deliver you! He is the light! And I want to give you hope that He has a hope and a future for you! So stay in with us here? Okay? Don’t check out cause we want to help you get out of that dark place! And Dawna, you and I have talked about this before and it is so important. It’s on the top of my list to you. We have to be careful what we consume media-wise. That includes the music on our playlists.

DAWNA: Uh-huh.

LAURA: That includes the movies that we watch! I would imagine it includes everything from what we eat, what’s in our refrigerator, what we drink! Come on, let me have it!

DAWNA: [laughs]

LAURA: I mean I know this is big on your heart too! What we do and engage in and watch affects our spirits!

LISA: But because he believed that about me I wanted to grow into all of that for him. And everybody grows in the really the example of the way they’re loved. And so nobody grows through criticism. People grow through nurture! And so John knew how to nurture certain things in my life that caused me to rise up. And I think too many couples they’re experts in one another’s weaknesses rather than experts in one another’s strengths. I personally thought like

JOHN: Or has the vision

LISA: if I could humble John

JOHN: Or, or

LISA: Pardon?

JOHN: Or has the vision to be able to see where that person can go. You know when you say

LISA: Right.

JOHN: weakness and strength, then that means, that means you might not see that strength right now but you look for the potential in that person to grow into that.

SID: Is that what the scripture means where it says without a vision the people or the marriages perish?

LISA: Absolutely!

SID: And it looks like the institution of marriage is being destroyed in every strata of society. Why?

JOHN: Lisa?

LISA: Okay. Well first and foremost I think this has been a long-term thing. I mean Jesus is talking to His disciples and when you know He had this confrontation with the Pharisees and the Pharisees are trying to find the legal outs for getting you know divorced and then Jesus is talking to His disciples in private and He says hey, you know, listen, you know I’m going to hold you liable to the original plan and they’re like wait a minute, wait, that means we’re stuck! And so I think there’s been a problem about people feeling like they’re stuck and they don’t really understand the purpose of marriage and we haven’t done it well. I mean there’s a lot of marriages right now where people are just not loving one another well. And so they’re either the man is strong and the woman is oppressed or the woman is strong and the man is oppressed. And, and there’s young couples coming up right now that are highly educated, have purpose on their lives and they’re saying we do not want to do marriage the way you’re doing it. It’s too small. It’s too limiting. It’s too oppressive. We want to do it together. And because they’re not seeing people do it well together they’re just saying then we’re just not going to get married. I’m want to be independent. We have some young girls, we have, we have, we have such a collection of amazing young women that work for us and one of them in particular is so independent, so gifted, so talented. She said I am never getting married! I’m not going to have some man squash my life! I’m not going to have them shut down my dreams! I’m not going to have them do that. And then when John and I did this taping she sat in there and she was crying the whole time and she said I’m now going to get married because she found out that marriages are not a power struggle where one person wins and the other one loses. Marriages are a power union. Both people become more of who they were created to be in God than less than.

SID: All right, John

LISA: And we haven’t done this well.